For The First Time Ever, I Agree With Rush Limbaugh

[Gold9472]

For The First Time Ever, I Agree With Rush Limbaugh

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_112805/content/truth_detector.guest.html

"I have come to the conclusion that there are a significant number of people in this country who still don't get it. It's going to take a couple or three more 9/11s, and I'm not kidding. I don't think there are enough people in this country that understand who and what we're up against."

Of course... not in the context that HE meant it... and the fact of the matter is, it is very sad.

[vernon]

So you beieve Bush blew up the WTC?

[Gold9472]

So you beieve Bush blew up the WTC?

I think the video evidence of the collapse of the buildings certainly looks like controlled demolition. I think Professor Steven E. Jones who recently wrote a paper on it should be heard, and I think his findings should be compared to NIST's findings in a public arena.

Do I think the Bush Administration was behind 9/11?

Absolutely 100%.

[vernon]

So you think it's part of the plot for "one world government"?

[Gold9472]

So you think it's part of the plot for "one world government"?

I think in the grand scheme of things, 9/11 was a "move" on the "Grand Chessboard".

[Gold9472]

vernon... is this belief something you find inconceivable?

[Partridge]

Not speaking for JonGold, but whether you call it 'one world government' (a definition I have many problems with, not least its very simplism), 'economic hegemony', or my personal perference 'Empire' is up to yourself.

The idea that powerful economic and military states/blocs seek to dominate and exploit the (natural/financial/human) resources of less powerful states/regions is hardly a startling revelation. This is how empires have acted throughout history - and the US contrary to what its propagandists and apologists would have us belieive is not 'unique'.

[Gold9472]

Not speaking for JonGold, but whether you call it 'one world government' (a definition I have many problems with, not least its very simplism), 'economic hegemony', or my personal perference 'Empire' is up to yourself.

The idea that powerful economic and military states/blocs seek to dominate and exploit the (natural/financial/human) resources of less powerful states/regions is hardly a startling revelation. This is how empires have acted throughout history - and the US contrary to what its propagandists and apologists would have us belieive is not 'unique'.

Excellent.

[Gold9472]

Where did he go?

[Partridge]

Why thank you.

I should say that the reason I disagree with the 'OWG' label is because, I don't think there is a concerted effort to establish a single unified global government (the UN is not even this - the UN is in fact relativley powerless) - the object of capitalist Empire is economic rather than political domination. That is to say, big business cares not WHO is in power, as long as that 'who' does not get in the way of making money/resource exploitation. If they can achieve that through pliant repressive regimes (such as Hussien in the 1980s, the Shah in Iran, Pinochet in Chile, Suharto in Indonesia etc etc) then thats all well and good - and of course military dictatorship have the added bonus of providing a market for the military industrialists. If they can achieve it through ostensibly democratic means (eg most of Western Europe), all well and good also. But if needs be, military invasion and old school colonial occupation are always an option on the table.

Either one of the Rockefellers, or the Rothschilds (and no, I don't think these people secretly pull ever lever in world affairs - they are very rich families though, and no doubt their wealth gives them considerable leverage - but I do think they are most definitely part of the ruling class) once said something to the effect that "If you give me the economy, I don't care who rules" - which I guess is pretty much true for capitalism in general.

But once a leader or popular movement comes along that threatens capitalist control of the economy (a revolutionary leftist govt, a radically left-reformist, or a even an economic nationalist [say Nasser's Egypt] govenrment) then the primary objective is to oust these by whatever means necessary. One need only look at the history of Western imperialist overt/covert interventionism in the 20th century to see this trend.

[Gold9472]

Exactly... they don't secretly pull the lever on everything... but they are the controlling class... you're a big Parenti fan I see.

[somebigguy]

For The First Time Ever, I Agree With Rush Limbaugh

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_112805/content/truth_detector.guest.html

"I have come to the conclusion that there are a significant number of people in this country who still don't get it. It's going to take a couple or three more 9/11s, and I'm not kidding. I don't think there are enough people in this country that understand who and what we're up against."

Of course... not in the context that HE meant it... and the fact of the matter is, it is very sad.
Whats he actually talking about? Getting tough with the terrorists?? If so, I agree 100%, but lets go after the real terrorists this time.

[Gold9472]

Whats he actually talking about? Getting tough with the terrorists?? If so, I agree 100%, but lets go after the real terrorists this time.

Well, the title of the article is "Left Doesn't Face Reality in War on Terror, McCain Torture Bill Misses the Point".

[Partridge]

you're a big Parenti fan I see

Well, its more like me and Parenti have a broadly similar outlook on the world. I actually have a degree in History (and I specialised in my final year in 'Post War American Domestic and Foreign Policy', 'European Communsim', and did a dissertation (thesis) on the Media and Terrorism), and pretty much came to the same conclusions long before I'd ever heard of Parenti. In fact Chomsky was probably a bigger influence on me back then, but without blowing my trumpet, it was more like Chomsky (and others) were putting in words what I wasn't yet able to articulate.

But you never stop learning things, and I do like Parenti's easily accessible style a lot. More historians/political sceintists should drop the acedemic jargon and esoterism and stop writing like they're speaking only to a bunch of people with PhDs.

[Gold9472]

Well, its more like me and Parenti have a broadly similar outlook on the world. I actually have a degree in History (and I specialised in my final year in 'Post War American Domestic and Foreign Policy', 'European Communsim', and did a dissertation (thesis) on the Media and Terrorism), and pretty much came to the same conclusions long before I'd ever heard of Parenti. In fact Chomsky was probably a bigger influence on me back then, but without blowing my trumpet, it was more like Chomsky (and others) were putting in words what I wasn't yet able to articulate.

But you never stop learning things, and I do like Parenti's easily accessible style a lot. More historians/political sceintists should drop the acedemic jargon and esoterism and stop writing like they're speaking only to a bunch of people with PhDs.

Indubitably.

[PhilosophyGenius]

I know I'm a little late in this convo but a "One World Government" is no longer possible in this day in age. Considering all the powerful alliances and nuclear armed nations that exist nowadays.

[vernon]

vernon... is this belief something you find inconceivable?

Well, I don't mean to be insulting, but yes, it is inconceivable to me.

It would be like believing men did not land on the moon.

Can you refer me to something which makes you believe it is a conspiracy? Hopefully something not too long for now. I have an open mind and will at least check it out.

[jetsetlemming]

Open minds are good. I think there's plenty of evidence to suggest that something is being hidden, just not what that hidden info/event is. I'm concerned you're 100% on this, Gold, considering there are still unanswered questions.

[Gold9472]

Well, I don't mean to be insulting, but yes, it is inconceivable to me.

It would be like believing men did not land on the moon.

Can you refer me to something which makes you believe it is a conspiracy? Hopefully something not too long for now. I have an open mind and will at least check it out.

Fortunately for you, I do believe we landed on the moon. Unfortunate for you, there isn't any one piece of evidence I could show you that shows our Government was complicit in 9/11. There have been books written that have 100's of pages as to why I think this way. I have spent countless hours of my own time researching 9/11, and other aspects of our Government. Only when you put 2+2 together does it equal 4.

However... I can shatter your idea that our Government wouldn't do such a thing with one simple document.

Operation Northwoods (http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113)

Read through that document, and tell me what you see.

[Gold9472]

Open minds are good. I think there's plenty of evidence to suggest that something is being hidden, just not what that hidden info/event is. I'm concerned you're 100% on this, Gold, considering there are still unanswered questions.

100% that the Bush Administration was behind it? Why would that concern you? I've looked at ALL the possibilities, and they ALWAYS lead to Bush. I've looked at Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Iran, Britain, Israel, Iraq, etc... and in every instance, there was an American finger in the pie. An American finger from the Bush Administration.

[Gold9472]

Vernon... let me ask you this one question. Why do you think the Bush Administration fought every attempt to create an "independent" commission to investigate the 9/11 attacks?

[somebigguy]

Fortunately for you, I do believe we landed on the moon. Unfortunate for you, there isn't any one piece of evidence I could show you that shows our Government was complicit in 9/11. There have been books written that have 100's of pages as to why I think this way. I have spent countless hours of my own time researching 9/11, and other aspects of our Government. Only when you put 2+2 together does it equal 4.

However... I can shatter your idea that our Government wouldn't do such a thing with one simple document.

Operation Northwoods (http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113)

Read through that document, and tell me what you see.
Good job Jon, thats the best place to start. Remove any illusions that the government "would never do such a thing".

Vernon, if after examining Operation Northwoods you are still not convinced, I suggest examining the incubator lie which led to thousands of deaths in Iraq:

http://www.911blogger.com/2005/11/incubator-lie.html

[somebigguy]

Open minds are good. I think there's plenty of evidence to suggest that something is being hidden, just not what that hidden info/event is. I'm concerned you're 100% on this, Gold, considering there are still unanswered questions.
Gold is 100% on this, and for good reason. Ask yourself one question, who has the power to prevent Norad from doing its job on 9/11?

Once you answer that question, you discover who is inexplicably involved in the attacks.

[Gold9472]

Gold is 100% on this, and for good reason. Ask yourself one question, who has the power to prevent Norad from doing its job on 9/11?

Once you answer that question, you discover who is inexplicably involved in the attacks.

The martians?

[jetsetlemming]

I'm not sure I understand your question. What is Norad's job invloving 9/11? I'm assuming it's investigating, but I didn't know Norad had anything to do with that.

[Gold9472]

jetsetlemming... go look up NORAD, and tell me what their purpose is...

[somebigguy]

Hey Jon, we talked about Norad's mission statement in a previous thread. Here it is:

NORAD continuously provides worldwide detection, validation and warning of an aerospace attack on North America and maintains continental aerospace control, to include peacetime air sovereignty alert and appropriate aerospace defense measures in response to hostile actions against North America

USNORTHCOM Mission Statement

United States Northern Command conducts operations to deter, prevent and defeat threats and aggression aimed at the United States, its territories and interests within assigned areas of responsibility; as directed by the President or Secretary of Defense, provides military assistance to civil authorities, including consequence management operations

From here: http://www.hsdec.org/charter.aspx

[somebigguy]

And yes, it was the martians as well as the saucer people.

[somebigguy]

...and the reverse vampires...

[PhilosophyGenius]

I see 9/11 as a puzzle. You can't see anything with only once piece. Only with when all the pieces are connected that you see the picture. Each fact regarding the government's invovlement in 9/11 can easily be rubbutled. But when fact after fact keeps on comming in, it gets to the point where it's undeniable.

Holla!

[ThotPolice]

Vernon the question you should be asking you’re self is not; How could a government do this? It is; how can we prevent government/s from doing it again? I’m sure you are familiar with the Reichstag fire set in prewar Nazi Germany? Blamed on communists in order to have the peoples blessing for war. It is historical fact Hitler’s gov set that fire.

Then ask your self what would they have to gain?

The whole gov is not corrupting but an elite few with the most power, this happens in most countries and it’s common they abuse what powers they have for personal gain or for agenda. The states happened to have a lot of power. A war in the Middle East means stronger economic hold in that part of the world ensuring the US’s economic dominance for years to come. As well American people have lost personal libertys (patriot act) and there is all that nasty catholic fundamentalism wafting about (Agenda). What would be the personal gain for these elite few? How about billions? http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5399

It doesn’t sound at all crazy to me that an elite few would view the sacrifice of thousands as a proper coarse of action, if it meant fulfilling their agenda, strengthening their country or just for the billions of dollars.

I do think those buildings were rigged. Ask SBG or just look at it, it’s Hollywood perfect. And then there is Trade tower 7 …I mean come on!!

[Gold9472]

Well... let him digest the idea that the Government could, and would do something like 9/11... I want HIM to ask US what we know... that's the only way people learn... is to ask... It means they're genuinely curious... ;)

Here's one you might have missed...

http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4324

[ThotPolice]

It's right in your face. They know people will put two and two together they just want them to except that two and two equal five.

[Gold9472]

It's right in your face. They know people will put two and two together they just want them to except that two and two equal five.

There's a reason for that. Don't you think it's the least bit scary?

[jetsetlemming]

"Would they?" doesn't just straight to "How to stop a repeat?", it goes to why and how first.

[Gold9472]

"Would they?" doesn't just straight to "How to stop a repeat?", it goes to why and how first.

huh?

[ThotPolice]

There's a reason for that. Don't you think it's the least bit scary?Hell yeah it's terrifing. It shows they don't care about resistance because they are that powerfull.

[Gold9472]

Hell yeah it's terrifing. It shows they don't care about resistance because they are that powerfull.

There are several articles about why it's so hard... would you like to read a good one?

[ThotPolice]

Sure, But it wont stop with love ins or ballot pulls. It wont stop untill force is used. They have the most powerfull force on the planet.

[Gold9472]

Sure, But it wont stop with love ins or ballot pulls. It wont stop untill force is used. They have the most powerfull force on the planet.

http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=391

They don't have the numbers.

[jetsetlemming]

its just that the question of "why would the government blow up the world trade center and the pentagon" is a sticking point for me. Not that I don't think they're capable, its that those seem like too valuable targets, esp. since there are places that matter less to the military and economy.

[ThotPolice]

http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=391

They don't have the numbers.

Good article, Lets hope the people wake up!!!

[Gold9472]

its just that the question of "why would the government blow up the world trade center and the pentagon" is a sticking point for me. Not that I don't think they're capable, its that those seem like too valuable targets, esp. since there are places that matter less to the military and economy.

I think Philip Zelikow, Executive Director of the 9/11 Commission, said it best... in 1998...

...in the November-December 1998 edition of Foreign Affairs, Zelikow co-authored an article entitled "Catastrophic Terrorism (http://www.foreignaffairs.org/19981101faessay1434/ashton-b-carter-john-deutch-philip-zelikow/catastrophic-terrorism-tackling-the-new-danger.html)" with former CIA Director John Deutsch and former Assistant Secretary of Defense Ashton B. Carter. The article speculated that if the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center had succeeded in causing the Twin Towers to collapse, "the resulting horror and chaos would have exceeded our ability to describe it. Such an act of catastrophic terrorism would be a watershed event in American history. It could involve loss of life and property unprecedented in peacetime and undermine America's fundamental sense of security, as did the Soviet atomic bomb test in 1949. Like Pearl Harbor, the event would divide our past and future into a before and after. The United States might respond with draconian measures scaling back civil liberties, allowing wider surveillance of citizens, detention of suspects and use of deadly force. More violence could follow, either future terrorist attacks or U.S. counterattacks. Belatedly, Americans would judge their leaders negligent for not addressing terrorism more urgently."

[ThotPolice]

its just that the question of "why would the government blow up the world trade center and the pentagon" is a sticking point for me. Not that I don't think they're capable, its that those seem like too valuable targets, esp. since there are places that matter less to the military and economy. Right then it would seem pretty silly that islamic militants took out toms hardware store.

[jetsetlemming]

Right then it would seem pretty silly that islamic militants took out toms hardware store.
Huh?

[jetsetlemming]

I still say they'd get the same emotional reaction from america that they did if they just hit the wtc alone, or some other target(s), like the statue of liberty or something like that.

[ThotPolice]

It would HAVE to be an important economic or military structure. Something that would shock and awe the entire nation.

[Gold9472]

I still say they'd get the same emotional reaction from america that they did if they just hit the wtc alone, or some other target(s), like the statue of liberty or something like that.

I think I've told you before... I have no idea why they picked the targets they did. I do know that the WTC as a target makes sense because it already was a target in 1993. It makes sense that "they" would try to hit it again. It would be more "accepting" to individuals... "Well... they've been trying to take those out for years. They finally did it."

[jetsetlemming]

They hit an important economic AND military structure. Both. One was more than enough to shock and anger the country.

[jetsetlemming]

I think I've told you before... I have no idea why they picked the targets they did. I do know that the WTC as a target makes sense because it already was a target in 1993. It makes sense that "they" would try to hit it again. It would be more "accepting" to individuals... "Well... they've been trying to take those out for years. They finally did it."
Nobody mainstream has questioned 9/11, and without poeple like yourself, staying on the subject and pushing on for more and more info, that islamic terrorists did it would be common knowledge. And I still think if the government would have done it, they would have picked places less important to the government.

[Gold9472]

They hit an important economic AND military structure. Both. One was more than enough to shock and anger the country.

I remember what it was like that day... the first plane hit... I thought, "dumb pilot"... then the second one hit, and I thought, "it's a terrorist attack", and then we waited... to see what was going on... we "calmed down" a bit... and then the news hit about the Pentagon... and then the anxiety was up again... not knowing what was going to happen, etc...

I'd say it was pretty effective, regardless of the targets... It did the job.

[Gold9472]

Nobody mainstream has questioned 9/11, and without poeple like yourself, staying on the subject and pushing on for more and more info, that islamic terrorists did it would be common knowledge. And I still think if the government would have done it, they would have picked places less important to the government.

Nobody in "mainstream" has questioned 9/11?

IT'S ON NOW!!!

[ThotPolice]

They hit an important economic AND military structure. Both. One was more than enough to shock and anger the country.The plane that hit the pentagon, happend to hit the renovated part of the building no one was in there, of course they would not kill important people, but it had to be bigger than anything else for them to achieve their agenda. This applies to both the official story and the conspiracy.

[Gold9472]

Nobody mainstream has questioned 9/11, and without poeple like yourself, staying on the subject and pushing on for more and more info, that islamic terrorists did it would be common knowledge. And I still think if the government would have done it, they would have picked places less important to the government.

http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=550.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=614.html
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[ThotPolice]

http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=550.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=614.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2245.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2515.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2557.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2603.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2628.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2677.html
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2697.html
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HAHAHAHAHA

[ThotPolice]

Vernon where did you go man?

[jetsetlemming]

He didn't seem like he was looking for a arguement.

[ThotPolice]

I know, me niether, just want him back on the board.

Where did he go?

[jetsetlemming]

Why'd you want him back?

[ThotPolice]

Why not?

[jetsetlemming]

Just wondering.